Sunday, November 11, 2007

healthcare. kinda.

P - I accidentally deleted your comment - sorry about that! I wanted to comment on it and I just hit reject instead of publish. No idea why. So here's my comment, all in it's own post!

Yes, you are lucky for living in Canada for it's health care. Our health care isn't the best for the type of nation we are. The US has something like 301 million people vs 33 million in Canada. Managing health care for ~268~ MILLION more people is a little more daunting of a task, don't you think? You told me that I should fight for managed care, but I don't know if that would work for us. I'm very interested IN care. And I think if you can't afford it, there should be something in place, but nationally managed care for the US? I honestly don't know and couldn't fathom coming up with an opinion without much research. If and when there is a measure for public health care, I will vote on it. Canada's health system works for Canada. But to push for managed care for a nation with 90% ~more~ people just because it works for someone else, someone much smaller?

I'm glad Canadians have health care guaranteed to them. I'm glad Canadians can leave their jobs and be paid some amount for a 12 month long maternity leave. It's freaking awesome and I'm jealous that I don't have that. (okay, not jealous of 12 months off. I'd wither and die) BUT, I'm not jealous that the United States doesn't have it. We're a different country with a buttload of different problems. Good problems and bad, very bad problems, but out problems. I do think one of our problems is healthcare. And something needs to be done. I just don't know what the solution is.

I didn't mean to make this sound like I was anti managed care nor anti Canada. Nor am I meaning to sound like you said anything but nice things to me! You just mentioned Canada's managed care and since I have strong feelings about it, I thought I would express them. You just brought up the opportunity to post about it - you didn't cause it! :)


Kim said...

I agree with you... SOMETHING needs to be done, but the solution isn't that easy.

Oh, and thanks for checking up on me :O). Ideally, I'd like two mature follicles to work with. But, for US, I would push to continue if there were three for a few reasons. One being that we don't have time to cancel cycles unless we REALLY need to cancel. We only have two cycles left to work with. Secondly, after these two cycles, my amazing insurance will be gone and we're fairly certain that we would NOT fork over the money for injectable/IUI cycles completely out of pocket... we would just go to IVF. Anyway, it's really an individual thing, and heck, my opinion could change if we DID have three. I just think there's a very fine line between 2 and 3 and when you're using superovulation, it's not that easy to control 2 vs. 3 (easier, for example, to control 2 vs 4 or 5). But anyway, thanks for your comment, as always! :O)

Poltzie said...

You did not come across as anti anything actually.
I'm not sure about the health care for more people, it's actually split into provinces in Canada so maybe if they did that it would be easier? I'm sure there are lots of things to consider with a much more populated country. I just think it sucks that all your fertility issues have to be paid for when we get it free - ya know! I do know there are many other larger countries than Canada that have universal health care but I don't know enough about it to comment!
As far as the maternity leave in the States that is just fucking unacceptable. Did you know that the US is one of only five countries that don't offer a paid maternity leave!! The other countries are seriously third world too. I can't believe that such a family focused country has such a shitty mat leave.
Canada has a great leave but it's not even close to being the best. You should see the programs in place in France to promote breeding (for lack of a better word), it's amazing.
Anyways I'm not sure what I meant by "fight" (my brain is mostly mush lately) but I just think it sucks for you guys!
That being said, you are able to buy much cooler things at a way better price so maybe it all works out in the end?

nancy said...

I rather enjoyed my maternity leave. 12 weeks, which is double many people's minimum's, so I can't really comment on how lucky or unlucky I am. I personally know how ~I~ am and I would not, no way, no how, want to stay home for 12 months. I'm a good mother and the time home is quality time. We try to max out daycare time, but in all honesty, I believe my kids have been given a giant advantage in daycare. My 3 year old walks around the house pointing to stuff and spelling it. She's the most social of creatures. She amazes me everyday. This is ~not~ to say someone who stays home with their children cannot get the same results, but I know ~MY~ limitations. I dont think I could focus their days into practically fun school days. ~shudder~. Staying home for 12 months literally makes me freak out a little! To be out of my career for a year? I don't know how it works there, but how do you jump back into it, expecially into a field like IT? Of course, I'm speaking from an end of not knowing how it works, how it makes provisions, etc. I do understand that.

Speaking of my career - I have to get going!!! :)

Poltzie said...

With the Mat leave I know lots of women who don't take the full 12 months. The great thing is that it's not just a Mat leave. Many of my friends have husbands who work from home and took the last 6 months or who didn't work from home but took the last 6 months anyways. At that point mom is ready to go back to work and the baby can actually interact, giving dad some great bonding time.
I think the nice thing is to have the choice, either way it's paid if you want it. I know lots of moms who said that they were not ready to go back to work after three months (baby still nursing is a big reason why) but after six they were more than happy to get back into the work force. I think that the more choices you have the better. And yes I agree that daycare can be a wonderful thing.

nancy said...

oh - I'm sure it works for many reasons. Like I said, I have no idea ~how~ it works. But the plain ole idea of ~me~ staying home, out of the workforce, freaks me out.

All I can say is I breastfed BOTH my babies for 12 months each. They 1st 6 months was breastmilk ~only~ and then we moved to cereals too. Cows milk came in at the one year mark with both and I can't say I had any complaints. I had to pump at work, but we have a law that allows it. The location of where I was during the day didn't interfere with feeding breastmilk at all. In fact, she went from breast to bottle since very young, helping me out in more ways than one.

Oh, and my husband didn't get any time "off" and he bonded with his children just fine.

Anonymous said...

I understand how you feel regarding the situation in the US because it's always been that way. However, that does not necessarily make it the right thing. The problem with the health care system in the US is that it needs to be financially profitable. That is crazy!

Doctors should not be worried about the bottom line. They should be worried about honoring their oaths as doctors... ie taking care of people! So many individuals are refused treatment because they do not have insurance. I do not know how some of these doctors that refuse to treat people can sleep at night.

I highly recommend that you watch the Michael Moore movie "Sicko". It demonstrates health care systems in many countries. My favorite line was, "You pay according to your means and you receive treatment according to your needs." That is not true in the US. It's just food for thought... The French have it best and know what they are doing. They control the government, the government does not control them...

Lisa (aka: hisangelface) a proud Canadian!

nancy said...

I've seen "sicko" and it's very skewed. Just like the movies to glorify the putredness of fast food.

Hey, I'm not saying there isn't a problem. I'm just saying that just because it works in canada (or even france, which has 61m residents. Still, only 20% of the US) doesn't mean it would work here.

Be happy for your own country, try to stop belittling others. Doesn't anyone realize that when they say these things, that is what they are doing? I don't know. I've always been one to root for the home team and not boo the other team. Call me crazy.

I hope one day we have a solution. I do. But small town answers can be hard work for big cities. We'll figure it out. Hopefully.

Anonymous said...

I think the United States could have managed care! All we would have to do is stop protecting the Western hemispere! What a plan. And even stop building things like highways and have an 'Only Road' like Canada. That would give us enough money!!!

Anonymous said...


My comment was not to belittle the United States. I am extremely proud to be a Canadian. I have nothing against the United States or Americans.

The people who can afford to live in that type of system do not see it as a problem because they don't worry about getting sick. There is a huge division of wealth and everybody is out to care just for themselves. I pay a lot of taxes here, and I thankfully have not had to use very much of the healthcare system. But, in still contributing, I am helping out my fellow Canadian...

I think the big issue with regards to how you see the issue has a lot to do with your situation. You are able to get fertility treatment (let's be clear that I am not saying you don't deserve it). When you compare it to a life saving procedure, it is pretty minor and quite a luxury. There are many people in the US that die because they can't get life saving medication or surgeries because they can't afford it. It is sad especially when it happens to many young individuals that have their whoel lives ahead of them. Maybe we are losing very important people that could greatly impact society but we will never know...


nancy said...

Lisa - you say nothing that I don't already totally agree with. I know we have an issue and I know it's not an issue ~personally~ because I have coverage (I do NOT have fertility coverage, but that's besides the point, because I can afford it).

My point of belittling was just I hear A LOT of Canadians say the "you suck and we rule!" when it comes to that. Since I've been around on the ttc/parenting(maternity) boards for what? 4 1/2 years, I've heard it a lot and I guess it's just starting to make ~me~ feel defensive about it. It's nothing YOU said. It's just something dozens and dozens of Canadians have said to me over 5 years. And since I'm a proud American, hopefully you'll understand (you don't have to accept) my viewpoint! :)

jennifercarol said...

This is a little later, but as a health administration/policy person this post piqued my interest.

There are a lot of countries with a national health care system that works well for them, and that is great. However, I do not see this working for the U.S. in the forseeable future. Politically and culturally its untenable. The U.S. is principally founded on the idea of individual choice and freedom to create their own destiny. Now I don't want to get into an argument about whether those principles are right or wrong. But the chances of a national health program being successful in those circumstances is highly unlikely and so the U.S. must find a solution that better aligns with cultural imperatives.

Anonymous said...


I completely see and understand your viewpoint. I just wanted to say that I am saddened when I hear about people whoa re sick and can't get the help they need due to lack of money or coverage.

I understand why it can be frustrating to hear from so many belittle your health care. Trust me, there are many times when we hear how much better the US is compared to Canada. I guess I am just happy with where I live and a proud citizen.

On a side note, I hope you are doing well and that you get the wonderful Christmas present you want so badly! Make sure you write a letter to Santa at the same time as your girls do.